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> SegaSonic arcade final, has just been blown wide open
Nash
post Jan 24 2004, 04:34 AM
Post #41


It's back...

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Nemesis, you never cease to amaze me. Shame on the people for shouting 'hoax'.


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RyogaMasaki
post Jan 24 2004, 04:42 AM
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GUESS WHO'S BACK, BACK AGAIN

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EDIT: I'm dumb.

This post has been edited by RyogaMasaki: Jan 24 2004, 10:22 PM


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Nemesis
post Jan 24 2004, 10:36 AM
Post #43


There's no such thing as 2

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Ok, here's the guts of what I know about these games at this time. First of all, the levels are as follows:

Level numbers:
0x03: Trap tower (4)
0x04: Landslide limbo (5)
0x05: Starting area (0)
0x06: Game intro
0x07: Control tutorial
0x08: Volcanic Vault (1)
0x09: Icy Isle (2)
0x0A: Desert Dodge (3)
0x0B: Robotnic (7)
0x0C: Eggman's Tower - 1 (7)
0x0D: Eggman's Tower - 2 (7)
0x0E: Eggman's Tower - 3 (7)
0x0F: Eggman's Tower - 4 (7)
0x10: Wild Waterways (6)

Any level numbers outside of this crash the game. The numbers in parenthesis after some of those levels indicate the order in which those levels occur in the final game.

The final level, Eggman's Tower, is actually divided up into five parts. The first part starts inside, after having entered the building at the end of the previous level, wild waterways. This first inside area leads to an outside area that runs aruond the building on some railings, then back inside to the next level of the tower. The next level of the tower is very similar to the first, and consists of an inside area followed by an outside area on some railings. This then leads into the top of the tower, and the faceoff with Robotnic. Put simply, level numbers 0x0C, 0x0D, 0x0E, 0x0F, and 0x0B are, in that order, all parts of the same level.

Now it appears that all the levels that exist in the final are present in the beta. While several of the levels are just totally blank, and the camera just scrolls through them with no objects, the level maps themselves are all complete. In the beta, level 0x10 (wild waterways) is not normally accessable through the level select, as it only goes up to 0x0F, but if you change the value at 0x10FC98 to 0x10 while level select is active, you can select and see this level in the beta.


On the technical side, there are three primary values I have identified that are of interest. They are as follows:

0x10FC31: Core engine state (byte)
0x10FC8B: Game engine state (byte)
0x10FC98: Level (short/le)

The level is straightforward, and all those values have already been posted. The core engine state value is a value that the engine keeps to allow it to keep track of what it is suppost to be doing. It has a few simple modes, which are as follows:

Core engine state:
0x00: Warning
0x01: Test menu
0x02: Ranking mode
0x03: SEGA screen
0x04: Demo 1
0x05: Demo 2
0x06: Game
0x07: Unknown

Also attached to this state value is the preceeding byte at 0x10FC30. This byte lets the engine know if it has been in the same state for a cycle already, and hence, if all the data for what it is suppost to be executing has already been initialised. If this is set to 0x00, the game engine will start executing the function it is set to do from the start. You should always set this byte to 0x00 if you change the engine state value yourself.

The game engine state vaue is just another value that the game engine keeps that lets the game know what it is doing, however this value is only used when the core engine state value is set to 0x06, which is the mode it is set to while a player controlled game is running. This value has a lot of settings, and a lot of them are hard to figure out. Here are the ones I know the function of so far:

Game engine state:
0x03: Normal level
0x04: Level map
0x08: Stage select mode
0x09: Ground check mode (beta only)
0x0E: Game over
0x10: Unknown (shows lightning from intro)
0x17: Level complete
0x1B: Character select
0x1C: Unknown (Camera autoscrolls)
0x1D: Level results screen
0x1E: Unknown (level fades and restarts)
0x1F: Fade out to "You Failed"
0x20: "You Failed"
0x49: Unknown (drops back to warning)
0x4E: Unknown (Interesting lockup)

The ground check mode is a mode that only exists in the beta it would seem. When in ground check mode, the character disappears, and the screen scrools over the level. There are many other ways to achieve this, but in ground check mode, pressing the player 2 action button a few times gets you past obstacles where the game is waiting for an event that is never going to happen like that, like for the character to walk somewhere. This allows you to get right to the end of any level. Pressing the player 1 start button quits this mode.

There's another tidbit in the test menu too. In the final, there's a lost menu option in the space just above the "exit" option. It's something to do with moving the seat or some other crap. To access this menu, make a savestate in the test menu and change the byte at 0x10D648 to 0x09, and the lost menu will be selected.

Here are a few other miscellaneous values I've locked down too:

0x109164 - 0x109166: Rings player 1 has (short/le)
0x10F282: Time remaining for boss
0x10FC34: Character control status (set to 0xFF for full control)
0x10FC6E - 0x10FC70: Time remaining in demo. Set to 0x0000 for infinate. (short/le)
0x10FD04 - 0x10FD08: Pointer to level sprites (long/le)
0x10FCA4 - 0x10FCA8: Pointer to level collision boundaries (long/le)
0x10FE09: Level transparency


In addition to all this, the final at least has quite a bit more to unlock. There is apparently a "Fence Set Mode", and a "Scroll skip mode", as well as some kind of general debug feedback to be enabled, and who knows what there is in terms of lost tiles and objects and whatnot.


Anyway, here's some techie info on the rom files in the final game, for anyone who might find it useful. I'll be going back to the roms shortly and taking a much more thorough look, so I'll probably add to this quite a bit.

CODE
------------------------------------------------------------------------------
128KB:
epr-C-86.8      code
epr-C-87.17      code

256KB:
epr15785.36      sound driver/midi's
epr-C-81.18-epr-C-80.9     Pointer tables/program resources

1MB:
mpr15791.31-mpr15793.29-mpr15795.27-mpr15797.25  Additional art
mpr15789.14-mpr15788.5     Graphics set 0
mpr15782.33      sound samples
mpr15783.34      sound samples
mpr15784.35      sound samples

2MB:
mpr15790.32-mpr15792.30-mpr15794.28-mpr15796.26  Additional art


------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Graphics set 0:
-Two roms are interleaved with mpr15789.14 coming first. Roms are interleaved on a word basis, with 2 bytes being read from mpr15789.14, then two bytes from mpr15788.5, then 2 bytes from mpr15789.14, and so on.
-There are 0x4000 blocks, with 0x80 bytes per block in graphics set 0.
-Blocks are 16x16 pixels, with 4 bits per colour, which is looked up on a palette table that has 0x400 entries.


------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Graphics set 1:
-Stores 0x1000 blocks. Scratch pad for anything it seems. Stores mappings and extra patterns.
-Appears to store 8x8 blocks, so that would be 0x20 bytes each.


------------------------------------------------------------------------------
mpr15791.31-mpr15793.29-mpr15795.27-mpr15797.25:
-This block appears to store some additional sprite art. Related mapping data may also be present.
-The 4 roms are interleaved together. At a guess I'd say the order is mpr15791.31-mpr15793.29-mpr15795.27-mpr15797.25, based simply on the names of the other interleaved roms.


------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Sound Samples:
-8-bit PCM sound samples of varying frequency. Signed format with primitive sign bit.


------------------------------------------------------------------------------
epr-C-81.18-epr-C-80.9:
-Interleaved one byte at a time, with epr-C-81.18 coming first.
-Mapped into memory location of 0x00100000
-Starts with pointer tables. Leads into what is probably either level mappings, sprite mappings, sprite locations, or all of the above. Hell, the damn things have to be somewhere.


------------------------------------------------------------------------------
mpr15790.32-mpr15792.30-mpr15794.28-mpr15796.26:
-Interleaved one word a at a time, with mpr15790.32 coming first, followed by mpr15792.30, then mpr15794.28, and finally mpr15796.26.
-Contains sprite art.


This post has been edited by Nemesis: Jan 24 2004, 10:44 AM


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dead_screem
post Jan 24 2004, 11:12 AM
Post #44


4 super emeralds

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QUOTE
QUOTE
The V60 is 16bit the V70 is 32bit (the V70 is a 32bit V60)


Are you sure? It looks 32-bit to me. Then again, I haven't delt with that wide a range of processors.


QUOTE
According to system16, the V60 is indeed a 32-bit RISC CPU. It runs at 16Mhz so that's probably where you got that from.


System 32 isnt exactly trustworthy... regardless, its in the mame source many times that the V60 is 16bit and the V70 is 32bit... the multi32 driver for example, but its elsewhere. that and ive seen mame devs refer to it as 16 bit.
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Dude
post Jan 24 2004, 11:17 AM
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TEN THOUSAND FISTS IN THE AIIIIIR

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QUOTE(Nash The Hedgehog @ Jan 24 2004, 05:34 AM)
Nemesis, you never cease to amaze me. Shame on the people for shouting 'hoax'.

dude, nobody shouted hoax.


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Nash
post Jan 24 2004, 11:56 AM
Post #46


It's back...

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QUOTE(dude2004 @ Jan 24 2004, 08:17 AM)
QUOTE(Nash The Hedgehog @ Jan 24 2004, 05:34 AM)
Nemesis, you never cease to amaze me. Shame on the people for shouting 'hoax'.

dude, nobody shouted hoax.

Gah. my braain doesn't work on weekends....that's a bad brain.
Yeah....yeah sorry, 'dude'.


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Mask of Destiny
post Jan 24 2004, 12:07 PM
Post #47

Objective-C == suckage

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QUOTE(SpinelSun @ Jan 24 2004, 11:12 AM)
QUOTE
QUOTE
The V60 is 16bit the V70 is 32bit (the V70 is a 32bit V60)


Are you sure? It looks 32-bit to me. Then again, I haven't delt with that wide a range of processors.


QUOTE
According to system16, the V60 is indeed a 32-bit RISC CPU. It runs at 16Mhz so that's probably where you got that from.


System 32 isnt exactly trustworthy... regardless, its in the mame source many times that the V60 is 16bit and the V70 is 32bit... the multi32 driver for example, but its elsewhere. that and ive seen mame devs refer to it as 16 bit.

Some people have an erroneous definition of the bit-width of the processor. From what I can tell the V60 is a 32-bit processor with a 16-bit bus (much like the 68000), but it is the width of the integer registers and not the data bus that determine the bit-width of a processor. However, from the sparse info I've managed to find on the chip, it appears to have a CISC architecture, not RISC (although it does have oodles of registers like a RISC chip).


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Demi
post Jan 24 2004, 12:52 PM
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CulT Demigod

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Still can't even get the damn thing to work...can someone please explain to me why its saying the files are missing? Its pissing me off.

This post has been edited by Demi: Jan 24 2004, 01:12 PM
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SSJP
post Jan 24 2004, 01:02 PM
Post #49


HAS DS, erm... SSUK = Lurker now. =/

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VIDS PLZ. =P


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Rockman Zero
post Jan 24 2004, 06:25 PM
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Zero rules

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Overdue Post: SW33T! :D


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Stoko
post Jan 24 2004, 07:14 PM
Post #51


^WE LOST A GREAT MAN

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I swear to god, this community'd be lost without this guy. You are far too kind, Nemie. Good job.


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RyogaMasaki
post Jan 24 2004, 10:41 PM
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GUESS WHO'S BACK, BACK AGAIN

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Ok, so I found a slightly different (easier) way to do this with the final. Instead of saving state in a demo, do so at the title screen. Go to 0x10FC98 (the level reference) and enter whatever level you want to go to. Reload the state, insert coins, select your character, and you should be at the level just fine.

It works fine for me. Any problems with this Nemesis?


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Trigger
post Jan 24 2004, 11:14 PM
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Go Team!!

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Huzzah for quick-glance difference screenshots!

For whatever reason, the sprites the characters use during the opening sequence of the prototype were all canned, and replaced in the final, giving our little furry sprinters more "serious" looking faces. Ignore the fact that in the final the background doesn't appear at all, it's to do with bugs within the emulator.

IPB Image IPB Image

Sonic running, and then getting caught, prototype.

IPB Image

Ray running, prototype. Ray doesn't change expression for his "ohshitthebastardcaughtme" moment.

IPB Image IPB Image

Ray and Sonic running, and this time Ray has a grimace change as they get caught, final.

IPB Image IPB Image

Mighty running and getting caught, proto.

IPB Image IPB Image

Mighty running and taking a shit, er.. getting caught, final.

There's also a few changes to Desert Dodge:

IPB Image [img]http://www.triggerhappy.pwp.blueyonder.co.uk/segasonic/differences/desertsnakefinal.gif[/img]

This Snakelike thing that chases you through a part of the stage changes colour between the two versions. Prototype on the left, final on the right.

[img]http://www.triggerhappy.pwp.blueyonder.co.uk/segasonic/differences/desertblockproto.gif[/img]

[img]http://www.triggerhappy.pwp.blueyonder.co.uk/segasonic/differences/desertblockfinal1.gif[/img] [img]http://www.triggerhappy.pwp.blueyonder.co.uk/segasonic/differences/desertblockfinal2.gif[/img]

In the prototype (top), a Caterpillar kind of robot blocks your path, it just appears in blocks, and walks off the other side. In the final (bottom two) this is replaced by these purple and light blue spheres, that come out of the ground like a wave, constantly. They both have the same effect when hit (lose some health and get knocked back a little), although the spheres make an additional explosion noise when smacked.

This post has been edited by Trigger: Jan 25 2004, 01:04 AM


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ICEknight
post Jan 25 2004, 02:06 AM
Post #54


MASTER EMERALD

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Heh, it looks like Mighty still wasn't so tough in the prototype.


But is the final version Japanese or American? For all we know, SEGA of America could have made similar changes to those in Ristar (omg angry characters) or Dynamite Headdy (colors and enemy designs).


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WittyName
post Jan 25 2004, 09:48 AM
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Can someone post the hacked savestates for lazy ol' me?
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Knuckles Prower
post Jan 25 2004, 09:58 AM
Post #56


We've got your Dust Hill Zone right here

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QUOTE(ICEknight @ Jan 25 2004, 07:06 AM)
Heh, it looks like Mighty still wasn't so tough in the prototype.


But is the final version Japanese or American? For all we know, SEGA of America could have made similar changes to those in Ristar (omg angry characters) or Dynamite Headdy (colors and enemy designs).

I didn't think the English Language version was ever dumped. o.o; I'm pretty sure the final's all japanese, since the japanese text and voices were all extracted recently, weren't they?


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Ego Trip
post Jan 25 2004, 10:28 AM
Post #57

Needs more cowbell.

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QUOTE(blackbird @ Jan 23 2004, 11:14 PM)
For God's sake, here's the rom: http://www.sonicstrike.net/users/sonicroms/roms/ (scroll down to "System 32")

Revision C is a valid file, but clicking on revision A gives me a 55KB corrupt ZIP file. ;_;
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DOCKY99
post Jan 25 2004, 10:56 AM
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Post savestaes :) :

>>
http://tryagainprod.site.voila.fr/sonicsta.zip


cf. http://forum.sonic-online.net/viewtopic.php?p=47181

Post cheat final 20S (difficult !!!)
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Demi
post Jan 25 2004, 11:55 AM
Post #59


CulT Demigod

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nm, thanks Rattleman.

This post has been edited by Demi: Jan 25 2004, 12:58 PM
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RattleMan
post Jan 25 2004, 01:07 PM
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Denial Ain't A River in Egypt. 7 Chaos Emerald + 2 Super!

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QUOTE(DOCKY99 @ Jan 25 2004, 08:56 AM)

It says incomptatible save-state version...I'm using 0.78b.


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